damn !!!! Grace you been running around with a ruler .

I'm telling you she's that spam bot that's always posting the Viagra stuff here.

yeah well my carload a spam is bringin in the alumni so shutty.

since in most cases this ain't hunting , why should it bother me as a hunter ?

as for why i wouldn't be against it ??? no different than a cow having a steel bolt driven into it's head .

frankie

But it's called *hunting.

frankie

*see above

ok ,, i think canned hunting in most cases is not hunting .

would i do it ? no !!!!

would i try to ban it ? no !!!

the deer they kill is no deader than the one i kill .

yes ,, there is pie in the sky but i never saw any .

by her post ,,,, i think she is a very naughty girl indeed . the word "dick" does come "up" a lot in her posts

Not my cup of tea, so I simply do not do it. I will support others RIGHT to do it however. Unlike some on here who believe that their ideology should be the moral and legal compass for everyone. ..... Plus I would like to hear a definition of canned hunt that actually applies to the REAL ( as in not imagined ar crap) hunting operations.

It's not that the animals are innocent and defenseless. To the ARA ideolouges, that generally applies to all of them. And for the most part, they give two shits about the animals anyway.

That there is profit perhaps being made drives a great many ARAs, who often hail from the far left of the political spectrum.

It's an easy target since it's easy to characterize and stereotype in a manner that many people find esthetically distasteful. That's VERY attractive, since it is a favored (because it's effective) ploy of authoritarian tyrants since time immemorial.

RF

That's a load of crap. I never believed that for a second, despite hearing it over and over here and there and everywhere (EL, etc.). I'm not so sure you believe it. It's one thing to be a hypocrite, but quite another not to give two shits.

Oh the ideolouges are as fond of animals as a mechanic is of his tools I suppose.

I suppose it's a handy argument to pull out, but not a very good one. How would you explain the AR's who volunteer time to save animals and get nothing ($) in return? As far as those organizations who pay salaries (HSUS, PETA) why would you begrudge someone a livelihood?

Like who?



I don't. I just wish they would find an honest one.

RF

So you're saying every ARA out there collects a salary for their cause? I think that's very improbable.

sure they do grace...maybe not monetarily, but they do gain more than the animals they claim to be helping.

What do they gain Steve? Taking over the world? Maybe you watch too many sci fi movies. They do help animals. Sure they might, at times, use some creative marketing tools, but what industry doesn't? Ever see advertisements for growing a penis? Many shelters/animal orgs operate on donations alone and need to market animals and/or causes. Shit you'll find some embellished stories on Petfinder, or hung on your local PetSupermarket adoption cages to tug at heartstrings to convince people to adopt who wouldn't otherwise do it. Instead of "Domestic short hair 7 years old"..."
"Holly is about 7 years old. She was picked up as a stray and wound up in Miami Dade Animal Control. Fortunately, we rescued her up in the nick of time! She is a total love bug and does well with other cats and dogs. Why don' you come by and meet Holly at our shelter, etc. etc."

Marketing is not illegal.

What exactly is a "canned hunt"? At what point does a regular hunt become a "canned hunt"? Would, say, hunting small game birds like pheasant or quail on 500,000 acres of fenced-in land be a "canned hunt"? Please provide a concise, specific, objective definition of "canned hunt".

500,000 acres? Who has that? Not sure there are any operations that large. But even if there were, any animal contained in a fenced area for huntng qualifies as "canned hunt". If a hunter happened on a deer right up on the fence, is that fair? Now before anyone says well what if it were a cliff, or a lake, etc. we're talking about man made barriers for the purpose of hunting, not mother nature's.

Really? Even birds? You know, they can fly over fences. You don't think that the size of the enclosure in relation to the size and range of the animals being hunted has any bearing on what is defined as a "canned hunt"? Much like "factory farm", or "vivisection", "canned hunt" is nothing more than one of the insipid, vacuous terms AR ideologues like to spit out ad nauseum to demonize those who disagree with them.

Grace


Grizzly


That's too stupid to even address.

How so? You made the claim that "any animal contained in a fenced area for hunting qualifies as a canned hunt". Birds can be placed in a fenced area to be hunted, however, they have an obvious route of escape. What's stupid is your definition of a canned hunt because it is simplistic and doesn't take into account the kind of animals being hunted, and their size and range in relation to the enclosed area. Thanks for playin', though.

They gain the warm fuzzy feeling they get from sticking their fucking noses in other peoples business.

I have posted before that( where the roosters are concerned) I have never seen true compassion for the animals from an AR. I see spite and vindictiveness and a " HA HA FUCK YOU WE WON" attitude.

They seem to gain peace from their guilt at being human when the "rescue" an animal and kill it for its own good..

Why not stick to the subject instead of moving goal posts Grizzly? WTF do flying birds have to do with high fenced hunting?

Steve


And it's all in your head.

Not moving the goal posts at all. I asked for an objective, specific definition of a canned hunt. You gave a definition, which is overly simplistic and flawed in its reasoning. I called you out on that, and now you claim a "goal post move" in an attempt to dodge. That just don't wash, Grace.

Grizzly



When I gave my definition, it was my definition number one. Unless you'd like me to pull one from the internet (and I can guarantee you it won't mention flying birds). You come back with hypothetical bullcrap scenario instead of continuing on the subject. That just don't wash, Grizzly. If there are fenced hunting ranges containing flying birds (that can fly over the fence) I would say that's fair chase and not canned hunting (i.e. where an animal can escape). duh.

so the criteria for you is that the animal can escape... at that point it is no longer a " canned" hunt? I assume then that the huge high fence operations where the deer or whatever can and do escape the hunters is hunky dory with you?

ever been in contact with em grace? I mean personal contact not third hand info like you rely on for everything else? I have never seen ANY compassion for the animals, just spite and hatred towards the humans ( kinda like you ).... grab the roosters, kill em as fast as possible then taunt the owners.

The concept is never hunky dory. The fact animals have escaped doesn't mitigate the fact these "hunters" are participating and supporting a fabricated "hunt". For a lotta money.

http://www.fieldandstream.com/node/57222

so once again it is not about the animals but this time it is the money? how is this any different then shrimpers ( I know beating a dead horse but your "thinking" intrigues me) dropping a huge net that the shrimp cannot escape from?

I'm talking about the hunters paying a lotta money for these fabricated scenarios. Buncha corporate high flutin wuss asses that couldn't catch a rat in their own underwear.

So now you claim that since flying birds, which, BTW are stocked in fenced-in, enclosed areas specifically to be hunted, can indeed escape, that it is fair chase. Yet before, you defined "canned hunt" this way: "any animal contained in a fenced area for hunting qualifies as a canned hunt". Which is it Grace? Since you are aware of the fact that birds can escape, would you care to actually be intellectually honest and retract your obviously flawed original definition of a "canned hunt"?

So what? Why do you give a damn what someone else does with their own money? It's none of your business, Grace. Butt the fuck out of other people's lives.

Grizzly

So there are fenced hunting preserves for birds which can fly over the fences? Why bother fencing it? What is the point?

We've been over this before. Your argument seems to hinge on the premise that deer hunting is some sort of footrace and the idea of fair chase is completely demolished by the existence of any fence.

That's just not the way it is though.

My friend has a deer hunting farm in Pike County. Look it up. Pike County is one of the premier deer hunting areas in the nation. He has a camper trailer for his hunting camp on that farm. The deer are so prolific that it isn't necessary to even leave the camper trailer to kill a deer if you don't wish to. Sit there in the morning drinking coffee and blast one from the window. And really, all that is lacking between that and 95% of the deer hunting that goes on around here is a short walk and a climb up a tree. In fact, the climbing part is lessening a great deal as more and more people go to hunting from ground blinds.

So....you sit in my friend's camper and kill a deer that walks by. Or you walk a couple hundred yards and sit in a blind or climb a tree and kill a deer that walks by. Or you pay a guy some money, walk a couple hundred yards and climb a tree or sit in a blind and kill a deer that walks by.

Now tell me again why the third scenario isn't "fair chase".

Um, probably to keep out trespassers ( like those who haven't paid or otherwise don't have permission to hunt there ). This ain't rocket science, Grace.

Can you please post a canned or high fenced hunting operation where they hunt birds, instead of elk, deer, boar, etc.? I googled but couldn't find any.

We have a gamebird hunting facility right near where I live. Not only that, the state operates a couple of their own.

RF

Shooting an animal out your window isn't exactly hunting. It's shooting an animal out your window.
Shooting an animal from a blind is hunting, regardless you didn't chase him for a mile. The concept of contained animals (some domesticated) in fences and an almost guaranteed kill (or, if no kill no pay) is not hunting.

And it's they're called canned or high fenced hunting? Is it run the same way as private individuals run high fenced hunting preserves? I've heard of game preserves.

"If what you are really looking for is a fair chase hunt go to one of these pages .." heh.


http://www.ihuntcanada.com/gameranch.htm

If that's your claim then you must point out a relevant difference, because I disagree.



That won't do because, unlike your faulty use of the term earlier....that constitutes begging the question.

Grace

RF

I guess I was fed a load of bullcrap all these years on these boards by hunters regarding "the whole experience" and how hunting is not just killing. If there are some schlaggs out there in trailer parks crushing beer cans on their head between popping off a deer crossing their window and they want to call it hunting, I can't stop 'em. But it's not. It's shooting an animal that happens by your window.

Yo Grizz you find a high fenced/canned bird hunting operation yet?

Here's a list of just a few of the private bird hunting preserves, lodges, and clubs just in Colorado alone:

http://www.gamebirdhunts.com/HuntingLocati...83/default.aspx

BTW, please define "high fence". "High" as relative to what?

I dunno I never heard of high fenced or canned hunting with birds as the game. Are these birds contained? I don't get the concept. Maybe people just don't give a shit about birds so don't care if they're shot like fish in a barrel, yet for the large game it's not ethical. I don't get it again.

I supposed "high fence" is high enough so deer, elk, boar can't jump it. I didn't assign the term but sounds right.

It seems grace that your argument is now what it is CALLED rather than what it IS.... And please explain to me how high fenced hunting is unethical but dragging a shrimping net is...or better yet how cattle farming is REGARDLESS of the method of killing? why do you simply not admit your hipocracy, admit you despise ANY hunting and move on?

Start a shrimp thread as it has nothing to do with canned hunting. Might as well bring up chickens people tackle in their barn and turn into francaise for fuck sake.