I wish it was in effect the day before Thanksgiving. Although my captivity was 3 min short of the 3-hour rule.


Gov't imposes 3-hour limit on tarmac strandings

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Stinky toilets, crying babies, airless cabins -- the Obama administration said Monday passengers don't have to take it any more. It ordered airlines to let people get off planes delayed on the ground after three hours. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood said the three-hour limit and other new regulations are meant to send an unequivocal message to airlines not to hold passengers hostage on stuck planes. Coming on the eve of the busy holiday travel season, the announcement was hailed by consumer advocates as "a Christmas miracle."

The airline industry said it will comply with the regulations -- which go into effect in 120 days -- but predicted the result will be more canceled flights, more inconvenience for passengers. "The requirement of having planes return to the gates within a three-hour window or face significant fines is inconsistent with our goal of completing as many flights as possible. Lengthy tarmac delays benefit no one," said Air Transport Association President and CEO James May. LaHood, however, dismissed that concern. "I don't know what can be more disruptive to people than to be stuck sitting on a plane five, six, seven hours with no explanation," LaHood said at a briefing.

This year through Oct. 31, there were 864 flights with taxi out times of three hours or more, according to the Bureau of Transportation Statistics. Transportation officials, using 2007 and 2008 data, said there are an average of 1,500 domestic flights a year carrying about 114,000 passengers that are delayed more than three hours.

Last month, the department fined Continental Airlines, ExpressJet Airlines and Mesaba Airlines $175,000 for their roles in a nearly six-hour tarmac delay in Rochester, Minn. In August, Continental Express Flight 2816 en route to Minneapolis was diverted to Rochester due to thunderstorms. Forty-seven passengers were kept overnight in a cramped plane because Mesaba employees refused to open a gate so that they could enter the closed airport terminal.


It was the first time the department had fined an airline for actions involving a ground delay. Transportation officials made clear the case was a warning to the industry. Under the new regulations, the only exceptions to the requirement that planes must return to the gate after three hours are for safety or security or if air traffic control advises the pilot in command that returning to the terminal would disrupt airport operations. Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said she thought the 3-hour rule would not cause any problems for security: "I can't imagine it would. I call it the rule of common sense," Napolitano said.

Airlines could be fined $27,500 per passenger for each violation of the three-hour limit. The regulations apply to domestic flights. U.S. carriers operating international flights departing from or arriving in the United States must specify, in advance, their own time limits for deplaning passengers. Foreign carriers do not fly between two U.S. cities and are not covered by the rules.

Tarmac strandings have mostly involved domestic flights, but the department is studying extending the three-hour limit to international flights, LaHood said.

"This is the beginning," LaHood said. "We think we owe it to passengers to really look out for them." Airlines will be required to provide food and water for passengers within two hours of a plane being delayed on a tarmac, and to maintain operable lavatories. They must also provide passengers with medical attention when necessary.

Airlines will also be prohibited from scheduling chronically delayed flights. Carriers who fail to comply could face government enforcement action for using unfair or deceptive trade practices.

Pending legislation sponsored Sens. Barbara Boxer, D-Calif., and Olympia Snowe, R-Maine, would also impose a three-hour limit, but the new regulations go even farther, giving passenger rights advocates many of the reforms they've sought for years.

"No more will they be able to strand passengers for over three hours in hot, sweaty, metal tubes," said Kate Hanni, founder of Flyersrights.org. Hanni, who called the rules a Christmas miracle, was stuck on an American Airlines jet in Austin, Texas, for over nine hours in December 2006 when storms forced the closure of Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport, stranding more than 100 planes.

Past efforts to address the problem have fizzled in the face of industry opposition and promises to reform.

Congress and the Clinton administration tried to act after a January 1999 blizzard kept Northwest Airlines planes on the ground in Detroit, trapping passengers for seven hours. Some new regulations were put in place but most proposals died, including one that airlines pay passengers who are kept waiting on a runway for more than two hours.

The Bush administration and Congress returned to the issue three years ago after several high-profile strandings, including a snow and ice storm that led JetBlue Airways to leave planes full of passengers sitting on the tarmac at New York's Kennedy International Airport for nearly 11 hours.

After those incidents, DOT Inspector General Calvin Scovel recommended that airlines be required to set a limit on the time passengers have to wait out travel delays grounded inside an airplane.

A year ago, the Bush administration proposed airlines be required to have contingency plans for stranded passengers, but the proposal didn't include a specific time limit on how long passengers can be kept waiting. It was denounced as toothless by consumer advocates.

AP Airlines Writer Harry R. Weber contributed to this report from Atlanta. Associated Press Writer Suzanne Gamboa in Washington contributed to this report.

Why is it that the passengers are inconvenienced but the government collects the money?

RF


ROFL RF!! So true!!

Uh-huh.

Still, I bet a lot of people feel good about that law.

Touche.

But don't you? I mean come on. When's the last time you've flown? Until you're held hostage you shouldn't comment. Maybe the govm't will do good with that money. Like reinstate peanuts on planes or somethin.

'89 or '90. These days I take the train, but it doesn't mean I haven't spent long hours sitting around and waiting for things.

I don't feel at all good about that law.

RF



...or any law.

If the subsequent fine, or percentage thereof, came back to the passengers pocketbook, how would you feel about that law?

The government arbitrarily decides that each passenger is valued at $27,500 per 3 hours? What sense does that make?

Well in retrospect, all of this is besides the point. You, my, everyone's rights are being violated when you're held captive on a plane on the runway. I'm a little sensitive to this because I just went through it. I felt frustrated and powerless and imprisoned. I really wanted OFF the plane. I wanted the OPTION to get off the plane. I really wanted to go HOME. You were under a lock down. It doesn't matter the fine or value of each passenger, the point is, airlines should not hold passengers prisoners ('cept while flying).

At what point in the delay did you decide you wanted off the plane?

As soon as he announced the delay LOL. Seriously.

Apparently only when you are held captive longer than 2 hr 59 minutes.

Then the law would have done nothing for you and your lemme off this fucker rights.

True. Being held captive for 2 hrs. and 59 minutes on a stuffy, over crowded, swine flu petri dish is a clear violation of ones rights and this bullshit law now pisses me off and doesn't make me feel good no more. Should be 45 min. Well, the good news is I fly 2 x year. But everytime I do, it's a nightmare. Lost luggage, delays, crying babies, fat on my side of the armrest, rude flight attendants, cancellations, security bullshit (forgot to mention on my trip they decided to audit my carry on... had to step aside. I believe the zip lock bag of Bustelo coffee might have set off the suspicion meter.) Images of Midnight Express came back.

I fail to see any law that will help you with your obvious learning disability.

Well maybe a law that requires you be provided with your own Cessna Citation.

I hate to shill for another government run enterprise, but seriously Grace. I bet a little over a hundred bucks would get you a train ticket to your destination and if you add another 150 or so, you could take the trip in a private roomette.

I've always wanted to travel by train, until I heard about my sister's trip. She just took Amtrak from PA to Charleston and hated it. Her feet swelled to 2 footballs. She felt imprisoned and couldn't wait to get off. The trip took 24 hours. She had a round trip train ticket but flew back home. I don't think I could sit on a train from Fla to PA. Way too long. Although that private roomette sounds nice. Could sleep half the way. Hmmm. I just might look into it next time.

I was wrong about the price though. Your upgrade to a roomette would cost you nearly 300 bucks. Weird. I pay about 100 for the basic ticket and another 100 for the upgrade from Il to Tx.

True, even with flight delays the train would take longer. But the roomette makes it tolerable or even enjoyable. You can sit and read or look out the window and watch the scenery. You really see things from the train that you probably won't from even an auto roadtrip. No elbows or petri dish conditions. Free coffee, juice, bottled water. Meals in the dining car included in the upgrade...and I've always been surprised that they aren't half bad. The seats in the roomette make into bunks at night.

$300 isn't bad. I paid $465 for my ticket and it used to be $242. Plus what they get you on bags and now they're charging for more "favorable" seats. Back in my hometown when my husband and I were courting, there was a hotel which was a series of restored train cars done up like the old Western trains with the red velvet interiors, tiffany glass, very grandious. Each car was a room. We stayed there a few times (he lived in NJ and would visit on weekends). It went under after a few years. Taking a train back home would add to the vacation I suppose. Oh wait, NO SMOKING on trains right? Foiget it.

I would say that the train stops on average once every couple hours at which time you can step off for a smoke.